Agree with you Rajesh.....

dear ranii irrespective of whats ur qualifications are

i want to ask are u joking

if u are a ca or ca student than u must have known the uncertainty of ca results 4 percent at at time or 25 % another

u know when the results are so less even the best efforts go in vain

if the institute does not change the course is it my bl**dy problem

and what do u mean by these lines

Everybody gets into the course, somehow 'decides' on material to study, looks for some shorcut classes, struggles on and on for several years without knowing what exactly to do. This has to change. In the present situation one has to really focus on what one wants than just passing the exam and looking for employment charity. 

in ur reply u sounded more like a tease and talking about quality

he he go get some life and please improve ur knowledge and update ur self

and if a person is fumbling in answering even a easy question then u think he is an idiot u know how  much he must have work hard to get 81 in sfm

Originally posted by : CA Sumit
	Do try harder in finding the Job. Don’t be selective for the city or profile. Occupy yourself at any place and simultaneously think what are your interest area and where you want the expertise and change your job as soon as you got what you were upto. While you are earning, always look out for your expected job (get internet connection and spend 2 hours a day) It is not possible that no one is looking for a CA. It is shame that  campuses are flop it is because the member in industries are idol they do not promote the profession and Institute is interested in Rs. 1000 irrespective of the Short-listing.

I am in favour of what CA Sumit said. So many jobs are coming in TOI, shine.com,etc. You should try again and definitely you'll get. But may be your salary expectations not match , but for gaining experience you have to start from somewhere as time gone it will not come again. Further seek a CA Firm where you'll get variety of work and there yo'll be able to know what you are good at and what you want to do. 

At all time while doing final most of the students read books & books, notes and all that stuff, but how many students get updated with current stream? How many read Business Standard daily? Many of final pass out even do not know Transfer Pricing !!!!!!!!!! 

         How can big companies hire U if you even just passed but not truly qualified?

         I asked two weeks ago a student who has given final Gr-II in last may What is GAAR?

        Woh gussa hua aur bola ye kaha DT ke syllabus main hain bhai?

        I affraid how can that person claim CA degree who is not knowing what is going on in economy? 

Originally posted by : Indian Bull
	I have a very very strong feeling that Amol Gopal Kabra is living in a dream world or probably he has a great sense of humour. His reply is full of logical fallacies. here are some to quote a few 1. If you can't get a job, it is not the profession's problem - Well, go to any reputed educational institute in India, say IIT or NIT or IIM or ISB and so on. Have you ever seen any person in helm of affairs of these institutes talk irresponsibly like this. they take steps to market their freshers in a better manner in each and every campus and in each and every campus they bring lots of newer companies/ firms in their placements. Has ICAI done anything like this? The CCM of ICAI also think like you only.  They dont market the freshers properly and as a result many CA freshers despite meritorious track are not properly placed in the Campuses of ICAI. they too talk like you irresponsibly saying "It is not our prob if you dont get a job". 2.I dont any CA cleared in Nov 2011 being unemployed. - Is this supposed to be a joke? check https://www.cmii.icai.org/ to have a reality check on the campus placements and the statistics will tell you the truth. Not only in Nov 2011, over the past two years, ICAI is not properly marketing their freshers properly. Generalising things by telling that statistics is a myth and no unemployed CAs exist and ICAI profession has a great value is not going to help the freshers. IF you have something worthwhile to share,share it with data from adequate sources and statistics. Statistics is showing that value of ICAI is coming down a lot. 3.you think your articeship was cheap, you will definitely be cheapest CA only because of your attitude - Has ICAI ensured a regulatory mechanism that every person who joins articleship would get uniform exposure? Ya, I agree some articles dont take articleship seriously but there has been a hell a lot of cases where the articled assistants are used by FCAs to do personal works like putting petrol for their bikes, cars,etc, purchasing vegetables from the market, purchasing books for their children,etc and had ICAI taken any steps to punish those members?(I still could remember those days when my CA used to make me do this personal works cos he is not able to find a servant at a cheaper cost. I literally thought of committing suicide during those days. Thank God transfer option was available those days and I too cleared CA at a young age and am well placed now in the industry but i feel pity for the new entrants and current freshers) and secondly Whats wrong in comparing work with money paid to us? CAs are earning a hell a lot of money solely because of the work done by articled assistants and paid staff. I dont think there is any harm in paying them more atleast to meet the cost of education, conveyance, cost of living, opportunity cost of doing CA(ICAI has banned studnets from doing additional courses during CA articles as well as from any income earning opportunity as well as from taking transfer when they get selected in a Big firm) Stipend need not be astonomically high but should be reasonable. 4. . If you look at the statistics, I dont think any campus of ICAI has been flop ever. - Biggest joke of the century. I once again request Mr. Kabra to visit icai's campus placement site https://www.cmii.icai.org/# and have some reality check or get his neuro checked by a good psychologist. 5.If any one else gets a preference of his cast for job, it is not the problem of profession. - For once,Mr. Kabra had spoken something logical and sensible. 6. Last but not the least " spoplease stop blaming any council member. These council members work for the betterment of ICAI, its students, its members and the Profession. So before talking anything about them, first try to understand their rensibilities. They handle the affairs of ICAI along with their own Professional Commitments. " - Again, Mr. Kabra proved that his sense of humour is reaching amazing heights. What have the council members done for the betterment of ICAI?? Give some examples, statistics, etc. to support this statement. the CCM are busy fighting for posts in Central Council level and hardly give a heck about whether their freshers are marketed properly and whether new companies come into for campuses and whether the freshers are paid appropriately...They handle the affairs of ICAI just to suit their professional commitments and not along with their own professional commitments.. Banning transfers, restricting students from pursuing additional courses, etc. itself shows how desperate the CCM are towards the welfare of students.i.e. Future CAs. Have they ever given a thought about how their actions are affecting the students of CA or the freshers??? Any ways, nothing to loose. It will only discourage the future entrants from taking CA or they may resort to dummy and bring bad name to ICAI by entering into industry or practice without adequate practical knowledge.                   As a CA, i have a great resoect towards this course and profession but this doesnt mean that i should have a blind adulation towards ICAI and simply be jingoistic to it despite all the things going wrong in the helm of affairs of ICAI. If any action of ICAI affects even a single innocent fresher CA or any student, it is like affecting you or me or any CA and their children..Think in this way, you will find no wrong in what prateek has said..

"SUPER LIKE.............. 1,00,000 likes to this msg..... Hats off to u sir....."

   In india per annum 1.3 million engineers come out. As per NASSCOM data 0.3 million engineers remained unemployed last year. But I never heard from them that B.E. is useless !!!!

   Every year 0.85 million MBAs come out. Actual requirement is 0.2 million in India and 0.25 million in abroad.

   They never blame MBA institutes.

   Every year 70000 LLBs come out

   Every year 20000 CAs come out. 

  So, never depend upon others. A bird sitting on a branch of tree does not fear of breaking branch. Because it   depends upon its own wings.

Originally posted by : Zulfikar Surti
	At all time while doing final most of the students read books & books, notes and all that stuff, but how many students get updated with current stream? How many read Business Standard daily? Many of final pass out even do not know Transfer Pricing !!!!!!!!!!           How can big companies hire U if you even just passed but not truly qualified?          I asked two weeks ago a student who has given final Gr-II in last may What is GAAR?         Woh gussa hua aur bola ye kaha DT ke syllabus main hain bhai?         I affraid how can that person claim CA degree who is not knowing what is going on in economy?

Listen its a universal fact that one cannot get expertise in all fields, subjects. That's why the provision for group clearance marking 50% agrgtt is kept. Exceptions are there but not for this fact. All seniors CA's, experienced and me too if you ask that which standard what says we'll not be able to answer if that particular standard is not applicable in our practice life...........We get expertise on the subjects which come regularly in front of us. Rest are just in books so that when required we can have a look on it.  Practical experience is really very different from what we study You'll come to know and will believe my words when you'll be at stage of ours. 

Originally posted by : Ranii
	The problem is not with the number of CAs passing out or the demand- supply balance. What about the quality? The whole world has changed, but the structure of the course and the method of examining students are stuck in the past.  and unlike ppl passing out of other premier institutions there is no uniformity in the quality of CAs.The 'range' is so vast. most of us expect to start with huge salaries. we are not super computers. Just passing the course just makes us only a calculator. Get real, update yourself, its up to you to make yourself a supercomputer. Institute has to see to that the course is revamped to suit the current situation.the imbalance is in the quality. all CAs are not made equally.We just expect the degree to translate into big jobs. Institute has to bring some uniformity in the quality of CAs passing out by making at least part of the course under its direct supervision. Now its like scattered all over, there is no common oulook towards what to aim for. Everybody gets into the course, somehow 'decides' on material to study, looks for some shorcut classes, struggles on and on for several years without knowing what exactly to do. This has to change. In the present situation one has to really focus on what one wants than just passing the exam and looking for employment charity.   i guess the campus actually burst the bubble of the mightiness of 'CA'. Somebody was telling me abt a freshly qualified CA in campus(SFM score 81), when asked whether an appreciation in the value of FC is good or bad for an importer , he was fumbling. So much for quality... super computer.

Dear Ranii, why there is no uniformity in quality of ppl passing CA? Cos of ICAI. Has it ensured any proper mechanism that persons who take CA will get Uniform amount of exposure and knowledge during articleship??? No...Secondly, persons expect reasonable salaries cos you see ppl give a lot of time, money and stress (emotionally, financially and physically) to acquire this CA degree..They cant expect to become a CEO or Vice President in the begining but for a Fresher CA, ICAI must fix a minimum threshold salary limit of Rs. 5 Lakh atleast in campus. has it done so? Even MBAs from TIER 2 colleges without adequate knowledge or core competence which an average CA has is placed well.. I cant understand what you meant by "In the present situation one has to really focus on what one wants than just passing the exam and looking for employment charity. ". What do think people do CA for?? either to do practise or to get a good job only. Some ppl do CA for the sake of their parents but i am talking abt the majority lot in first category...regarding CA fumbling in the campus, come on, just remember as a student, we study and memorise everything but once we get qualified, we refer our books not study our books. Just ask any CA in industry who is working in any non traditional area any question in DT, he will surely fumble cos he will not be in touch with the same after qualifying cos his work profile requires him to have diff set of knowledge

Originally posted by : Rajesha
	If Statutory powers are not there with CA, it would equal to normal degree... Only Statutory powers make CA , a hot cake... Becasue even ICWAI has equal curriculam and toughness compared to CA. But it is not shining like CA only becasue of statutory powers...

Dear Rajesha, I dont know to which profession you belong but I strongly reccommend you to see he Income Tax , Cost Management, SFM, Accounting And ISCA paper for CA Final And same for the IPCC. You will know why there is Statutary power to CA and not for ICWA. 

Originally posted by : Zulfikar Surti
	At all time while doing final most of the students read books & books, notes and all that stuff, but how many students get updated with current stream? How many read Business Standard daily? Many of final pass out even do not know Transfer Pricing !!!!!!!!!!           How can big companies hire U if you even just passed but not truly qualified?          I asked two weeks ago a student who has given final Gr-II in last may What is GAAR?         Woh gussa hua aur bola ye kaha DT ke syllabus main hain bhai?         I affraid how can that person claim CA degree who is not knowing what is going on in economy?

Students dont read business standard daily while they prepare for exams simply cos of the fact that suppose assume that you have appeared for FInals in May 2012, you need to remember all the provisions applicable for May 2012 exam..In the news papers they give info about a lot of changes which will be applicable from the next assessment year which may not be useful for the purpose of exams. When ppl prepare for exams, they keep the results alone in their mind and prepare...they can update their knowledge after qualifying CA by reading books, journals or attending CPE sessions of ICAI. You said that you asked a CA student about GAAR some two weeks back...see for CA course, your memory is tested a lot...with a mountain like syllabus, you cannot expected persons to remember some thing on which they have not worked recently or not studied recently..FOr instance, approach any top rank holders in recent exams and ask them some questions. Ex, X got rank in Nov 2011 and in working in Financial Services CO in Financial Services division. GO and ask him questions in SFM, he may give good ans for u. Ask the same Ex some ques in DT or IDT, he will obv fumble. Will u say that he is not truly qualified or not a true rankholder?? X will have knowledge of DT and IDT if at all he has to work in it recently either in office or for studies..And after qualification, ppl aim for specilisation, so you cant expect each and every fresher to know about each and everything which is going on in the economy. They will know and remember things which will have an impact on them or whcih will affect them only

Mr.Rajesha

If Statutory powers are not there with CA, it would equal to normal degree... Only Statutory powers make CA , a hot cake... Becasue even ICWAI has equal curriculam and toughness compared to CA. But it is not shining like CA only becasue of statutory powers... Mr.Rajesha  

"You have hit the Bull's Eye"

Hi everyone,

I am still a student and I have no idea of what the employment situation is at the moment, so I won't comment on that. However, I would like to bring to your notice a few other things and it is my humble request to all of you to give it due consideration:

1) My father is a director in a private group of companies. He was in the banking industry for more than 25 years and over the years, has gained considerable knowledge, expertise and experience in the field of Finance. He is not a CA but considering his knowledge levels, he is quite on par. There is a standard HR system in his company but when it comes to hiring CA's, he has the ultimate authority and he conducts the interviews himself. And till date, as hard as it is to believe, he has not come across a single freshly qualified CA with whom he has been impressed. I ask him why is that. And the answer is always the same. Quality or rather, the lack of it.

Now, I am mature enough to understand that a freshly qualified CA can't be expected to know everything that an industry veteran knows. But it is also true that as a CA, we are expected to have some degree of knowledge and awareness that goes beyond what is there in our sylabbus. Someone in a previous post suggested we should read financial papers and update ourselves. It is a very significant point. I myself read Bussiness Line religiously and I am discovering the benefits. Slowly, but surely, I am inching ahead of my peers. Many of them have absolutely no reading habit and this is gonna cost them in the long run. Sadly, hearing my father speak, that is the state of affairs with many freshly qualified CA's. Why does one need to wait till he becomes a CA and then do all these things? Why can't these habits be cultivated at the student level itself? It hardly takes me 30 minutes to read the paper daily. 30 mins in a day is meagre. I have also subscribed to the Member's Journal and will start reading it from next month. All these extra things may not bring you visible benefits in terms of exams and passing them, but trust me, it counts a lot when you face interviews and enter the industry.

2) Second, a lack of depth resulting from lack of curiosity. My boss always tells me that when I go on audit, I should concern myself not just with how I audit, but also with what I audit. He says that if I am not curious about what I am doing, I will never be able to learn anything. Put simply, if I don't know an accounting entry, it is no use trying to audit the same. He has a classic line which I always recall, "Why try to be a Chartered Accountant, if you can't be an Accountant first?"

This issue was also highlighted by my dad. He had interviewed a freshly qualified CA for one of his companies which is engaged in construction. That CA's resume mentioned that throughout her articleship, she had done audit of construction companies. She was asked a question about the basic tender documents which are to be submitted in a bidding process. She had no answer. Because ordirnarily, she would have had been concerned only with the accounting and costing aspects of construction and auditing the same and would not have been expected to know anything beyond that. But that is what the industry demands. That little extra.

3) Third, communication. This is the one of the core areas where MBA's race ahead of us. Now, people might hold a view that communication doesn't really matter; adequate knowledge will offset poor communication. Fortunately or unfortunately, it is not so. Communication and a good command over the English language is an absolute must. So please, please put an extra effort towards this aspect. It WILL help.

I am a very reasonable guy and I fully realize that whatever I have said sounds good on paper but may not be realistic enough in a practical sense. But it is extremely important to incorporate it in our practical life to the extent reasonable. I don't intend to make it a personal issue by giving the example of my dad, but I get a lot of insight from him about how the industry works. I felt it may be useful to many of you too.

I apologize if my comments are unrealistic and offend anyone, but being a CA student, I always take it upon myself to help my fellow CA community people.

Guys i have no intention of hurting anyone's emotions... even i love to become CA becasue of my passion towards CA. But due to financial problem and other family problems i didnt take up... then i started looking at ICWA which i felt equal in curriculam... its my personal opinion... Thats it... no intention of hurting anyone... I apolozise for that... But i still feel, CA created monopoly because of statutory powers. I have seen both the courses syllabus i felt somewhat equal... i am not saying exactly equal.. All the best guys...

THE  PRESENT CONDITION OF CA KABRA SEEMS AS PRIME MINISTER MANMOHAN SINGH, WHO ALSO NOT WILLING TO ACCEPT THE TRUTH ABOUT HIS CABINET MINISTERS on CORRRUPTION. ALL PEOPLE WHO HAVE EXPRESSED THEIR EXPERIENCES HERE CAN NOT BE IGNORED AS THE ALL ARE SOMEWHERE RELATED TO THIS PROFESSION. MAY BE MR. KABRA HAS MORE INFORMATION ABOUT THE NUMBERS OF EMPLOYED AND UNEMPLOYED LET SEE WHAT FIGURE HE PRODUCES TO PROVE HIS STRONG SPEECH.