Response to Eco. Times article ;"MBA losing to CA......"

Nicely presented and analyzed. 

Thanks.

Please refer - 

/forum/ca-v-s-mba-72597.asp

'' To conclude; CAs will be CAs and MBAs will be MBAs. It is true that CAs value has increased a lot than it was 10 years back. But we still have a lot way to go. ''

WELL, THE VALUE OF EVEN PLUMBERS AND CARPENTERS HAS INCREASED FROM 10 YEARS BACK.... ITS PURELY DUE TO ECONOMIC GROWTH AND INFLATION. A RISING TIDE LIFTS EVERYONE UP. SO ITS NOT THE MAGIC OF THE CA COURSE. 

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ALSO, ANY SUCH NEWSPAPER ARTICLE SHOULD BE BASED ON FACTS AND FIGURES. THEY HAVENT GIVEN ANY FACTS AND FIGURES. ONLY THAT SOME BIG 4 FIRM IS PLANNING TO HIRE. WELL, IT IS A CA FIRM. SO IT IS BOUND TO HIRE CA'S ONLY. IF THE ARTICLES TALKS OF SUBSTITUTING MBA'S FOR CA'S SHOW A COMPANY WHICH IS ACTUALLY DOING SO RATHER THAN A CA FIRM ITSELF. 

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ALSO, LOOK MORE CLOSELY AND YOU WILL FIND THAT THE ARTICLE ACTUALLY GOES AGAINST COMMON SENSE. 

1) Loyalty also tilts the balance in their favour.

 I DONT KNOW WHAT BULL SHIT IT MEANS. BUT AS I UNDERSTAND, IT MEANS THAT A CA WHO IS GETTING BETTER PROSPECTS SOMEWHERE WILL NOT SHIFT DUE TO THE LOYALTY FACTOR BUT AN MBA WILL DO SO. WHICH COMPELS ME TO THINK, IS THE ARTICLE PRAISING CA'S OR SAYING WE ARE DUMB ASSES ???

2) If a company is unable to afford an MBA from a top B-School, it would rather hire a top CA. 

WELL, LOW QUALITY PRODUCTS ARE CHEAPER THAN HIGH QUALITY PRODUCTS. NO DOUBT ABOUT IT...

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FINALLY, I WONDER IF ITS A PART OF THE IMAGE BUILDING EXERECISE BY THE ICAI. SOUNDS FAR FETCHED BUT STILL, THERE IS A REMOTE POSSIBILITY. JOSE HAS SAID ENOUGH ABOUT SKILLS OF ICAI. WELL, I WOULD NOT ELABORATE ON IT. THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE SALARIES OF MBA'S AND CA'S SAY IT ALL. 

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@ Everyone. FOR THOSE WHO STILL THINK THAT THIS ARTICLE IS SOMETHING GREAT AND WHO WILL COMMENT THAT '' CA IS THE BEST '' , '' MBA'S ARE NOTHING '' AND BLAH BLAH BLAH, I HAVE ONLY ONE THING TO SAY -- GROW UP.... 

smell the coffee; mr author

Well presented and discussed by koolleo87  i.e. Hardik also. 

Dear Jose and Hardik, 

I am proud of you both.

Thanks. 

even i don't fully agree with the article in today's newspaper but one thing which i would like to share is that CA's value have increased over the past few years and it is nt just coz of the market conditions....yes i agree market conditions is one of the reason but its nt the only one....

In past years CA's were considered to be just accountants but its not the case nymore  CA's are there in every fields whether it be M&A, Business Advisory, TAS and they are also the in the decision making team in big co.s too....

The article did not mentioned that only CA's are the decision makers...it stated that CA's are also being hired for decision making jobs.

P.S. I agree that MBA's from 'A' category institutes will have an edge over CA's......

Thanks for being a true motivator CA SURENDRA KUMAR RAKHECHA
:)

hi , completly agree with Jose and Hardik ,

Jose like your hindi dialogues in between but at last superb!!! explaination bro

Thanks

The TOI article I must say was a very nice way of putting forth the facts of CA profession. All the blind followers of ICAI and members who feel that MBAs are a waste and CAs are great should really think twice before feeling happy about the TOI article. Some of the key takeaways of the reality of CAs in Industry are given below -

"Further, with Corporate India getting cautious with salaries, CAs are gaining a natural edge. “If a company is unable to afford an MBA from a top BSchool, it would rather hire a top CA than look for a management graduate from lower-rung Bschools,” says a global headhunter.

This para tells me that because CAs are cheap..they are being hired..thers absolutely nothing beyond that. The comparison is of a Top CA with a lower rung bschool…what can be worse than a top CA being compared to a guy from a lower rung bschool!

A chartered accountant’s average salary is at Rs 6 lakh a month, while for MBAs, the figure is the minimum, says Nagesh Pinge, chief internal auditor at Tata Motors.

This para clearly mentions about the salaries of CAs vs MBAs.

“Good MBAs are expensive compared to CAs. For tier-II cities, the average MBA salary ranges between Rs 4 lakh and Rs 6 lakh, while CAs are available in the Rs 2.5-3 lakh range. Both do similar kind of work,” says Dhruv Desai, senior VP (HR) at Angel Broking.

Again…this came as a big disappointment to me to know that there are CAs who work for 2.5 – 3 lakhs p.a. And guys who keep talking of salaries of CAs may kindly note the above figures and try to understand that even a roadisde vendor selling bhelpuri, sandwitches, wada pav etc earns in millions these days.

The company recruits CAs for back-office work which is more financial in nature, while MBAs are hired for front-office jobs where they have to interact with customers and use their communication skills. “Though our recruitment is predominately MBAs as we are customer-centric, the ratio is tilting in favour of CAs,”

This is the truth which ive mentioned in many forum posts…in Investment Banks…back office have 50,000 people…and front office have 50…that’s always been the ratio…you wuldnt find any pity poor green pen accountants among those 50...which is obvious because those positions are for classes and not massses. The salaries of these 50 guys collectively is more than the salaries of collectively all the 3000-4000 CAs who pass out in a year.

“Due to complexities of accountings and prospective taxation regime like GST and IFRS (International Financial Reporting Standards), you need CAs as MBAs don’t study these subjects,” says Sanjiv Shah, who runs an accounting firm in Vadodara. He says CAs are now assuming advisory roles as well. Mr Shah, who operates in the mergers and acquisition (M&A) space, adds: “If CAs have to take a decision about an M&A deal, their skills are useful during the due diligence process.”

I am happy to see this comment…that’s what CAs are meant for…doing accounting, auditing and tax related work. Due Diligence surely is an imp part…but that’s not the point which makes or breaks a deal!

to put this article in one line - its like kahin pe negahein kihe aur pe nishana....

the title of the article says MBAs are loosing value...but actually i feel this is written to target ICAI and bring about the reality of CAs in front of everyone.

Well said, krunal bro. I knew u would put out new logic to lambast the author; that 's why i requested  u to comment here. Why don't u comment the same on the Economic times website. I will post them there for u.ok

Insane article, it seems like ET hasn't been able to catch the pulse of the hiring market. 

It's important to start realizing that the value of work experience in a full blown corporate on your CV weighs heavily and goes down really well with future recruiters, it's time to stop thinking that pure academics and merit will get you through the placement process. It's why so many on the job training programmes and learn while you study programmes have cropped up recently, to catch on this trend, the progression in say a BPO after working 6 years there is quite a lot, in some ways more than 6 years of education can get you. That bent, the practical bent of training, say incorporating case studies, in the syllabi is lacking and really needs to be looked into.

Go and see the paper/questions of any professional programmmes conducted outside India, say CPA or CFA, the level of questions they are asking is on a whole different scale than what we are being tested for. We are being tested for the basic journal entries, and not the logic behind them, and with increasingly mechanized accounting systems and full computerization of the books, journal entries shouldn't be the focus anymore, it should be proper and accurate presentation of the financial statements. The institute is caught in the conundrum and is hardly focusing on updating the material to actually test concepts. 

Secondly, it's important to realize that specialization is important, have streams in CA final , make at the most two papers electives, which can be chosen by students and go indepth into the subject matter. 

These are all achievable changes, we need to start looking at how other professional bodies are conducting their exams and how they are lining their members for the emerging changes ahead. 

In my opinion, students are not properly guided during training.  Like unstructured CPE hours as prescribed by the Institute for members; training is also unstrucutured although  time frame has been defined. Practically very few principals really see the work diary of  articled clerks. 

In one of the forum; it was suggested that regular training tests should also be conducted to know who are "real" "dummy" articled clerks. 

Whatever has been published in Eco.Times is biased and I don't think it is important. The only benefit which we can derive from the publication is that it has opened our eyes - what management thinks about a CA ? We know what values we give to the industry but now it is time to rethink about our own values and accordingly we should charge with dignity.

They reason of charging low is because cost of education is "POOR" in comparison to MBA. But at another side; this POOR cost gives an opportunity to weaker section of the society to make a career brilliant.

The problem is that the Marketing Part of the most qualified members is weak and that is why they are unable to establish them  before Management.  

THE MOST IMPORTANT POINT IS - 

SINCE IN THE MANAGEMENT MBAs ARE APPOINTED HENCE RECRUITMENT POLICIES ARE ALSO DRAWN BY THEM.  THE MANAGEMENT WILL NEVER ACCEPT THAT A CA SHOULD BE GIVEN MORE PREFERENCE BECAUSE THE MANAGEMENT INHERENTLY KNOWS THAT CAs ARE BETTER THAN MBAs.

DUE TO THIS FEAR; THEY PREFER MBA (FINANCE) PEOPLE THAN CAs.

It is really unfortunate that we compare ourselves with MBAs. The issue was never raised by MBAs that why CAs ? It shows they are practically in better position than CAs. And this is due to the fact mentioned above. 

Some practical instances have come to my notice.

One of them is -

"A CA in job complained the same that he is given the calculation part by the management and the  reports prepared by him is JUDGED by an MBA.  If MBA is not in a position to understand the basis (certain assumptions) ; then he used to call CA. This CA was reporting to him."

I adviced him to search a new job even at a low package. I also suggested him  to leave the organisation when they need your services the most.  And accordingly he acted. When the MBA's performance was likely to be judged; CA intentionally delayed the report by adopting various means.  Management fired at MBA and called CA to give explanations. He replied that so far I was preparing the reports according to my assumptions but this time I decided that I should be directed by my immediate Boss  as he is more expert than me and that is why he is paid more than me. After saying this; he presented the reports which he had already prepared according to his own assumptions.

The management realized who is actually working behind the reports. The problem was lack of communication between the management and the CA. The problem of the CA was solved.

Still many CAs are lacking in liaison. Only due to this; they get less remuneration.  

I never read articles which compare one course to another. Why should a person need to compare MBA or CA or CFA vs other course ?  I mean every person have dream and course which fancies such a dream will be right choice for a person. So technically comparison it self is wrong. So don't compare, follow your dream.