Balance P/L for ITR4 for salaried w derivative speculative

ITR 2228 views 8 replies

p

30 Points Joined January 2009

Derivate losses in ITR4 - where to put these

Hi. I wanted to know where to include the derivative losses in form ITR 4. I am a salaried employee with derivative losses in the stock market, income from short term capital gain and day trading gains.

. I am confused, should I include anything in nature of business?

What about balance sheet and P&L.I have none of these computed. So where do I put the losses of derivatives.

Also, is it possible to offset the losses in derivatives with the profit in short term capital gains through securities transaction.

Please let me know. Would appreciate if you could tell me the exact specific lines where I include these items in the ITR4. Many Thanks for your help

Replies (8)

CA Vinay Saraf

148 Points Joined January 2008

LOSS FROM DERIVATIVE WILL BE TREATED AS ORDINARY BUSINESS LOSS & AVAILABLE FOR SET OFF AGAINST SHORT TERM CAPITAL GAIN

CA Shailesh +91 9393926464

Chartered Accountant

2088 Points Joined March 2008

It seems u r totally in dliemma regarding the following things:

a) Setoff of derivatives loss against STCG?

Ans: Business loss cannot be set off against STCG on sale of shares

b) Some Particulars of ITR to be filled in

Ans: U may end up in preparing defective return.... U may contact any CA to prepare ur IT Return.. U may also mail me the entire details, ur derivatives loss computation, shares income to my mail ID ca.shaileshk @ gmail.com for the preparation of Return.

Any other assistance, feel free to ask

Guest

Hi P,

Derivative income/loss shall be deemed to be business income/loss u/s 43(5). So it should be icluded as business income and you need to prepare the financial statement for this in case 44AA or 44AB is applicable to you.

Yup you can setoff it with STCG u/s 71.

Put it under point 51 "No Account Case".

CA Shailesh +91 9393926464

Chartered Accountant

2088 Points Joined March 2008

Oops....

I made a Blunder Mistake..........

Yes. Business Loss can be setoff against STCG on sale of shares.. I take my words back

CA Vinay Saraf

148 Points Joined January 2008

no matter its ok

CA Devanshi Gandhi (Ajani)

FCA DISA Mcom CIFRS & LLB

9060 Points Joined February 2009

u can set off rightly said by tinku

p

30 Points Joined January 2009

Dear All

I am thankful for such overwhelming response. However, my simple query is as below:

I made losses on speculation(intraday), business(fno) and short term(delivery and BTSTs). I am able to enter speculative (BP B.23-41) and short term losses quite well. Problem is in business losses, i have entered as below.

Profit before tax as per profit and loss account (item 43 or item 51d of Part A-P&L )		1	-136817
Net profit or loss from speculative business included in 1		2	-40023

fno loss, 96794, speculative loss 40023.

Now, I need to know, do I have to enter anything other than 'PARTB - TI - TTI', 'BP', 'CG-OS', 'EI',

Nature of Business	Filled	Schedule CFL	Filled
Schedule DPM	Empty	Schedule 80 IA	Empty
Schedule DOA	Empty	Schedule 80 IB	Empty
Schedule ESR	Empty	Schedule 80 IC	Empty
		Schedule STTC	Empty
		Schedule EI	Filled