@ Rubul

Same here bro..I too dont hv much knowledge about SAP. So here is my share of garbage :)

 

Actually we were talking about two different things altogether. I was referring to people who are actually involved in the implementation of SAP and you were talking about the guys(end-users) who work in companies which have already implemented SAP and therefore require working knowledge on SAP. These two are totally different areas. Pls check this link https://www.caknowledgeclub.com/chartered-accountant-SAP-ERP SAP consultants are specialized guys and not every CA wud be working as part of the implementation team of SAP and so doesnt require to pursue the SAP training that I mentioned in my earlier posts. Thats why I asked you in an earlier post about the need of imparting SAP training to everyone when only a few are actually opting to work as SAP consultants. And the training is really costly and its compulsory adoption by ICAI is impractical for the reasons mentioned in one of my earlier posts. But now I understand u are talking about the end-users of SAP and not the guys who design and implement SAP in a company. ICAI can maybe design a course for the end-user guys. I dont want to really comment any further on the end-user course topic since I dont have any idea about the practical issues w.r.t introducing such a course by ICAI. I think it is better to be silent when u are totally ignorant about something :)

Originally posted by : Rubul
	By the way even in your link in the very 1st point author has written "it is recommended to have the domain knowledge in particular functional area". And that is what i said SAP experienced and Experienced accountant both are different things. He is refereing to domain knowledge in particular functional area like payroll, Accounts Payable or receivable etc.

Of course 'SAP experienced and Experienced accountant' are two different things. You should definitely have domain knowledge to work as a SAP consultant(whether it is by work experience as an accountant or just thru ur articleship), no question about that. In my previous post(to which u hv replied), I was referring to experience in SAP and not experience in ur particular function. In the link to that discussion forum, the guys who complained of not getting a job were all without any experience in SAP implementation. They may have years of experience as accountants but are neverthless freshers as far as SAP implementation is concerned and therefore many of them were struggling to get their first break. 

 

If u are having working knowledge of SAP as an end user, maybe u have a much greater chance of breaking into SAP implementation than a total fresher in SAP..I dont really know about that..As I said, my knowledge about SAP is very limited. 

Originally posted by : Rubul
	But yes the fact mentioned about recruiter is my personal experience here is a link in which you can see a recruiter is searching for a candidate with knowledge of SAP just have a look at the package and the package offered is above the salary of an Average qualified CA and most important thing is recruiter's minimum educational requirement is B.com only.

For a person with 2-5 years of experience and working knowledge in SAP, the recruiter may pay 3-3.5 lac. I dont think thats a big deal. The question is whether the B.Com guy is able to build a successful career on the basis of his working knowledge in SAP as an end user. I dont think so. When u move up the career ladder, SAP working knowledge which was a value addition at the lower levels, wudnt be helping u. Thats where u will understand the value of a professional certification like CA. U can say a lot of things like only skills matter,etc. But in my opinion, a professional accounting qualification does matter(obviously subject to exceptions).  

 

Am actually curious to know whats ur idea of salary for an average CA. The advt. link mentions a salary of 3-3.5 lacs and u are saying it is above the salary for an average CA. So, according to u, salary for an average CA must be below 3 lacs. Am not for any debate on the average salary issue. Just want to get ur perception of the salary for an average CA. Thats all :)

If you can, please encourage. But don't, for god's sake, discourage someone. Your personal feelings cannot be impressed upon someone else. It is you who's made the decision and stepped into the course. If ICAI is the one whom you blame, the same ICAI has enabled many of the freshers get handsome packages. So it's the same ICAI..but the people are different. Mindsets are different. You only see what you think. I agree that everyone is not alike. But at the end of the day, it is you who should design your life colourfully. If you have problems, remember that god has given them to you only because he thought you could tackle them and set an example for others too. Please be positive. Whatever it might be.

As I already said my knowledge about SAP is completely different hence I won't comment on it.

As far as salary of an average CA is concerned it is arround 20-25K per month. And this is not my perception, it is a ground reality. Ofcourse there are CA's who are being paid a handsome salary of 36Lac but according to me it is an exception and I am speaking about mass of newly qualified CAs. CA's with experience of 2-4 years are paid arround 30-35K (in Delhi). You can verify it easily in various job portals like shine.com, naukri.com or timesjob.com etc.

@ Anusha if you are pointing to me than I want to clarify that I am neither blaming ICAI nor demotivating anyone. I am only suggesting some points which I think is beneficial for us. May be you are aware of the fact that BOS and board himself invites suggestion from students to update the CA course. If you think that my suggestion(s) have some valid points than I urges you (and all others) to please wrote it to BOS (Since they will not ammend the course just because of a single student but yes if many of us will suggest it than they might give a second thought to it) and if there is no valid point than ignore it. Simple.

@ Rubul

Thanks bro for the input..This is of course the ground reality in terms of the people whom you know and the advts which you have seen. But if u take the CAs allover India into account, it is just perception as no data is available for the average salary of all the CA freshers. Unless we have such data, we can only speculate and debate on the salary issue. Now my perception is 5-6 lacs p.a. as an average salary. I know there are many CAs working for 25k p.m but I dont consider that as an average salary. As I say, this is my perception and need not be true. And I dont want to get into a debate on this issue at all. I just wanted to know whats ur idea of average salary and also want to convey u my idea of average salary. The CA freshers(except one, all were multiple attempters) whom I know have all got placed for around 5-6 lacs p.m.(but they had to wait for 6-7 months before they got a job). Even my cousin sister who cleared in Nov 2013 in 7 attempts(including one attempt which she skipped) and whose articleship exposure was really really poor, got an initial salary of 35k p.m. My another cousin sister was saying that the ipcc passouts in their articleship firm were getting an initial salary of 25k p.m. just after finishing their articleship(they have no previous work experience). I understand the average salary cant be assessed on the basis of the experiences of the few people I know. As I already said, I am just sharing my perception about average salary:) 

Originally posted by : Rubul
	As I already said my knowledge about SAP is completely different hence I won't comment on it.

 

Actually your knowledge about SAP isnt entirely different from mine. You were referring to end-users(whether u are familiar with that term or not) and I was referring to the implementation guys. Thats the only difference :)

All I can say is "Congrats to your sis and friends". Rightly said that we can't debate on the basis of perception. Anyways my point is value addition and not average salary and I already proved it that even a B.com graduate can earn 3 lacs with the knowledge of SAP. Further you also agree to the fact that there are many CA (MANY even if not on an average basis) who are working at salary of 20-25K, so if a CA is working for a salary as low as 20-25K while a B.com is also earning 25K than it is really a big deal. So tell me "do you agree that it is better to introduce SAP as subject rather than ISCA???" I have mentioned some additional points in last part of my comment please consider them before answering the above question.

And as per my knowledge of SAP, a CA/CS/CWA cannot be a SAP-Consultant unless he knows VB, .net etc types of programming language (this is why I said that my knowledge is different about SAP). And I am telling you this with my personal  work experience. But there is a little difference, that my experience is with ERP software called LOGIC ERP. The guy who was implementing that system told me that LOGIC and SAP has no difference except that SAP enjoys a international brand name while LOGIC is a Indian ERP system. SAP is used by business entities because of its custom reports (there are other advantages also, but mainly it is used due to its report making ability; reports are used for analysis and control). To make custom reports there are commands to be written in programming language, CA has no role in it. The role of CA is that he will only give the format of report (like date, no. of units sold, rate, amt etc) and programmer will program it for him. SAP when implemented for the first time is like a open source program/stand-alone software with pre-loaded formats of reports, user modify it with the help of IT manager/implementing team (SAP CONSULTANT) and they are not CA/CS/CWA, they are from IT background like MCA, B.E etc. A complete package of SAP with all the modules (including FICO) along with other necessary software/hardware would cost around 30Crore(not that costly for ICAI) and annual AMC of 5-6 lac to be paid to SAP-INDIA. Private institutes charge around 4-6lacs to train a single module like AP/GL/Payroll etc. Further SAP is not software like MS OFFICE that one can install it from a CD. SAP can be installed/implemented by the team who is authorized by SAP-INDIA or employee team of SAP-INDIA. Hence SAP CONSULTANT must be an employee of SAP-INDIA or among the affiliated team of SAP-INDIA. This is my knowledge of SAP and thus this SAP-CONSULTANT certification to a CA (or to anyone who isn't an employee of SAP) seems valueless, as CA can't implement SAP. Although CA of the co. in which ERP is to be/being implemented is part of the implementation team but he is mainly related to accounting data conversion, designing framework of internal check to be given to programmer for converting that framework into actual operation in that ERP/SAP for eg. for sale below 1lakh there will not be any discount. This thing doesn't require any certification since a CA learn these things in auditing and assurance. And by SAP as a subject I mean practical end-user training (from the very beginning i mean end-user only).  

And

Some part of SAP-CONSULTANT training should also be part of the subject but theoretical only. Like how SAP is developed or customised, how it is tested etc. By this way it will cover whole of the SDLC part of ISCA and 80% topics of ISCA is SDLC and its related topic like testing, implementation etc. Don’t know how much I am correct but to me-: ISCA as a subject tells us about SAP/ERP, how they are developed, how they are tested, how to audit each phase, how files are maintained in it etc. My suggestion is tell us about SAP and with the help of SAP explain us SDLC and its topic. By this way it will be more interesting and is much easier to understand and will bring an in-sight about software developing process. The present system of ISCA as a subject is boring, and seems less-important to me further there is feeling “why we are studying ISCA?” 

FINALLY IT SEEMS INSTITUTE HAS REALISED THE IMPORTANCE OF THE COVETED SUBJECT ISCA AND DECIDED TO REMOVE IT FROM NEW CURRICULUM.

NOT OFFICIALLY CONFIRMED YET, BUT PROBABLY BASED ON SPECULATIONS AND RUMOUR MILL WORKING AROUND IT SEEMS IT WILL BE A REALITY SOON.

May this rumour come true, Amen.

Every course is complex in ownself.CA final course nominated in geenise book of world record in respect of tuffest course in the world so every CA students feel proud of this.CA has great opportunities in the today enviourment.it is sayimg that name is only thing which going with u after death.CA course also provide us this name and fame. U r creator of ur destiny

Every course is complex in ownself.CA final course nominated in geenise book of world record in respect of tuffest course in the world so every CA students feel proud of this.CA has great opportunities in the today enviourment.it is sayimg that name is only thing which going with u after death.CA course also provide us this name and fame. U r creator of ur destiny

Every course is complex in ownself.CA final course nominated in geenise book of world record in respect of tuffest course in the world so every CA students feel proud of this.CA has great opportunities in the today enviourment.it is sayimg that name is only thing which going with u after death.CA course also provide us this name and fame. U r creator of ur destiny

Its depand on you.... What you think about urself ...how hardwork you can do....

Its depand on you.... What you think about urself ...how hardwork you can do....